MKIV AKL for sale

[AKL 1333]

The 5 cars are all cery nice lightweight cars but not from the first 26? because all have the heater outlets under the front window but so what they all will make a lot of fun

[SJ351]

As far as the AC factory were concerned in period, there were true Lightweights, Lookalightweights and Semi-Lightweights, depending on build dates and specification. That is fact. However, this should not stop us from appreciating, accepting and embracing each car for what it is and for being the unique hand built vehicle that it represtents.

[Hobo]

@ SJ351: I agree with your statement. Each of these unique hand build AC cars should be accepted what they are, either true, semi or lookalike Lightweights.
   
   However - at first - I expect from owners and in particular from professional car dealer that they describe the cars what they really are. Otherwise the whole AKL-Lightweight issue is drifting in the same corner as we can observe for decades with the "true" CSX/COB-Cobras, which is a crying shame.
   I can't agree at all on any description which is obvious wrong - only for the purpose to gain the difference in market prices between a "true" one and the "others"......and the best way to hinder people to do so is creating transparency and disclose which ones are true and which ones not.
   It is so easy to convert a normal/"other" AKL into a "true" Lightweight......and I know what I'm talking about, as owner of one of the "other" Lightweights (AKL 1411, which is still 99% in original condition!) and AK 1073 (which does not carry a "L" suffix but is strictly build to Lightweight specification by factory!) – NO, I have NOT the intention to  create a "true" one from these sources :-)).
   
   Second: The differentiation between "true" (I think you refer to the row of the famous 26) and the others (other Lightweights/semi/lookalike) does not meet the point. There is a hughe number of factory Lightweights build and if only the 26 are deemed as true the other factory build Lightweights are "wrong"?? - for sure they are no semi nor lookalikes.
   
   Last not least, the fact that there is NO heater and/or NO demisters will never be a reliable evidence that you look at a true Lightweight.....and vice versa, because in all periods anything would have been build in by factory if only the money has been paid for, even a heater in a "true" Lightweight...therefore a true Lightweight WITH heater/demister is NOT a conflict.

[AKL 1333]

Absolut correct  Hobo also a car with a heater can be a true lightweight car, also a car with a efi engine  can be a true lightweight car and there are a handful cars without AKL VIN building to lightweight specifications also true lightweight cars  but all this cars are not from the first group of 24....25....26 or 27 cars which are build  in 1990/1991 to the most closely 1960s specifications with all lightweight details and without interiour parts of the 80s from other cars and of course without a heater. But of course they are lighter so they are lightweights and whatever you want they can be "true" lightweights

[Hobo]

Not to be missunderstood:
   I'm not against at all, that someone is converting his MKIV (AK or AKL) into a semi 427 s/c or close to the same specification of  the "26-Lightweights".
   Personally I also prefer the look of the "real" thing.
   
   But again: When a car – worth 6 digit pounds - comes to sales by a professional dealer I expect a professional job including a description of the car which is 100% correct and carefully investigated.
   Same applies when an owner introduces his car in the public area whether on a meeting, on an exhibition, by youtube-video or in a forum. Anything else is not acceptable for me.
   
   When it comes to the features of the Lightweights (I went through all the old threads of this forum from 2007 onwards) they are still not clear and are still confusing and I meanwhile believe there is no common definition (custom-hand-build by factory!!!).
   
   Even the weight as such is not very helpful as an indicator – because it seems that nobody knows about the exact weight of a Lightweight.
   First of all no clear definition of the kerb weight: with/without all fluids/necessary equipment (spare wheel/hood/tonneaucover/tools) and in particular tank empty/half full. etc. etc.
   Therefore too much talks and figures in the air in the range from 2050 lbs ("AK is 2250lbs – a AKL-Lightweight should be 200 lbs lighter"), 2350 lbs from the 93'-press release up to the 2520 lbs-figure provided by TLegate ("Cobra-The Real Thing", page 250).
   
   @ Jürgen: If we concentrate only on the "group of 24.....27 cars" - even the basic figure of the number of cars is not clear - I strictly do not believe that all of these cars have been delivered without any heater. If you know better, which is the reliable resource you extract this knowledge from?

[wenzeh]

I was reading this for a while and am throwing my two cent worth of thought in to this conversation:  AKL 1333, under your definition think about that:  AK 1005 (no L ) has for sure a much closer suspension set up then any lightweight (whatever build date), because in 1982 there was not that extensive use of  donation parts coming from Ford, Volvo, Renault or BMW or other cars as very early cars there is a one to one swap from MK III components having for example Girling brakes and all suspension parts etc. from MK III.  Now is this car then even of more value then a lightweight?  Is it even more real?  It has short nose as well?  The engine and gear box package was added in US as done with the original Shelby cars having engine (carb) and T10 gear box and even from the fabrication dates correct to get a 1966 registration?  Does this all increase the value of a car - even so there where only the "famous" 12 cars build with a kind of special history?
   
   Such little details as of having heater vents or not - I don't believe should add any great selling point to the lightweights.  Now there are differences so is the door hinge with side bar, the rollbar and the location of the fuel filler - including some difference on the rear fire wall.
   
   But as said by previous comments, all is possible to get modified and made to what people like, and not to hard as well.  We all kind of take advantage of a big kit car community and their parts, making such modifications quite simple and inexpensive.
   
   And we should not forget, that people tent to modify these cars to what they like - a Cobra seams by nature something people take their hands on - from past until today.  There are many examples of such modifications on this forum where people show with bride what they have done to their original MK IV cars.  And they receive applause from all of you for their great work.  Now, have they added value or did they destroy value?  Not sure to have the answer, but in Germany at least people with strong modifications to MK III level seam to make better prices then "original" MK IV's, even on lightweight cars.  And the power level of their engines seam to sell as well.  That's also a selling point for replicas today with asking prices far higher then a Mk IV would bring, even in whatever lightweight specification and build year.  And it looks like that most have the desire to modify their cars to get as close as possible to MK III specification - it looks  like everybody has the desire to get a car look a like MK III.  Are they butting their cars then to the same level as a kit car?  For sure it seams like that they sell better then not done, at least in Germany.
   
   For sure in performance with the later build lightweight cars there is a huge difference to a real MK III performance - these lightweight cars without modifications get busted by almost any other car with a little sport trim or a sedan with a decent diesel engine, even in acceleration.
   
   And even the earlier lightweights with their 345hp or so out of a 5 liter engine are not really getting to the performance levels a 427 SC is going to  - that's I guess why such cars have been strongly modified even right after purchase at Autokraft.  Is this increasing or decreasing value to these cars?
   
   Now back to the initial question, what makes a MK IV lightweight more special?  Was it the price people where willing to pay for it in first instance?  Are the first 12 cars build then even more special as being most close to 1960 specifications?

[AKL 1333]

Answer is very easy! Yes

[ANF289]

quote:Now back to the initial question, what makes a MK IV lightweight more special? Was it the price people where willing to pay for it in first instance? Are the first 12 cars build then even more special as being most close to 1960 specifications?

   I can't quit put my finger on it, but there is something inherently sad about this and related threads.  A Mk IV is a Mk IV, be it standard or lightweight.  A Lightweight, be it one of 26 or 73, is still a Mk IV.  Making a Mk IV a Lightweight doesn't make it a Mk III, nor does it make it better, significantly faster, or even better looking.  You can make any Mk IV go as fast as any other variant; even it's 60's brethren, so this is a pretty trivial point.  If you can't appreciate a Mk IV for what it is (a great sports car, a piece of rolling artwork, amazing for ever being built in its day, and even more amazing for being sold in Ford dealerships in the states), you may be what some Mk I, II, & III owners probably think you are: a poser or a wana-be.  A Mk IV is a Mk IV, and I for one love it because of how it came to be and what it is: an exceedingly fun car to drive. I can't understand the suspiciously self-serving need to make it more, or less, depending on how it looks or how you look at it.

[westcott]

Perfect statement, I totally agree !

[AKL 1333]

Surprise or not i totally agree too, a realy perfect statement and all the rest is personal meaning

[302EFI]

I must admit that I do not understand what exactly is being suggested in relation to the subject matter of this thread.

[shep]

It is indeed a funny old world. We seem to have developed a fixation with apportioning value to possessions for the sake of status, or financial gain. I have said many times before that I love AC cars irrespective of their value. I bought my Ace Bristol on 3rd June 1994 for 34,000 pounds. Today it may be worth many times that. The value makes no difference to the pleasure of ownership. Perhaps the opposite is true. Within the ACOC we find it progressively more difficult to tempt members and their cars to come out to play. In the 90's we would regularly see 20+ AC's competing at the Bentley Drivers' Club Races at Silverstone. Now we are lucky to get 3! At the same time the AC team of Cobras (Including Mk IVs) would regularly field 5+ cars for each AMOC Intermarque Championship race. Now there are none. Our Goodwood Sprint would feature 30 or more ACs. Unfortunately this is no longer the case and a dozen is a good turnout, supported by other invited marques. The other sad effect of this preoccupation with value, is that youngsters are rarely given the chance to drive dad's classic car. I am with you all, I just love the cars for their beauty, and try to ignore the rest of it. Use them in the rain, and give our sons and daughters a go!

[ANF289]

quote:Originally posted by 302EFI
   
I must admit that I do not understand what exactly is being suggested in relation to the subject matter of this thread.
   

   Here, here, Shep understands (see above)...

[302EFI]

I agree that for a variety of reasons it is unfortunate if people are preoccupied with 'value', thinking of their cars as status symbols or financial investment vehicles rather than enjoying them and loving them for what they are. However, it would not be right in my view to assume such an attitude on the side of the contributors of this thread on the basis of what has been discussed here.

[nikbj68]

I`m with you, Art, and Andy. Totally.
   The whole point of this thread, however, was to attempt to protect buyers of alleged Lightweight cars from paying a premium for a car that doesn`t warrant it. The market does apportion a value to our objects of desire, and as that value increases, so does the option to fleece the unsuspecting out of ever-increasing sums of their hard earned.
   The Lightweights are and always will be MkIV`s, but always attracted a premium ("Less is more" I hear you cry!). Semi, pseudo or repro Lightweights are no less beautiful or fun, but we all (I hope!) want future owners to get what they pay for, THEN bring them out to play!!!